While the 1972 351 H.O. DIY Ford Do It Yourself Ford Projects Ford 351 Cleveland Engine Breaker-Point Ignition Tips Point-triggered (breaker-point) ignition is a simple on/off switch that opens and closes the primary ignition circuit to charge the coil and reduce a brief discharge of high-energy current to fire a spark plug. The restrictor plate looks like it impedes coolant flow which leads a lot of people to remove it. Are they just mounting a remote module (without the heat sink) onto the distributor, but still wiring from the round plug off the side of the distributor? Most of the time, distributors are fine right out of the box. were both canceled, leaving a single revised version of the 351 Cobra Jet as the only remaining performance 351. The pushrod length may also have been wrong for this combo. Merci pour votre aide. If a heavy-duty oil pump shaft is installed in an attempt to crutch the problem [not the case on Mays' car], it can break the bronze gear to the distributor.". Main bearing caps for both had extended width to allow for the possibility of four-bolt mains. The design of the oiling system sent oil first to the cam bearings instead of the main bearings. File photos. Given the age of these engines theyll certainly need some additional TLC. After all, Ford called the Boss 351 engine the 351 H.O. Your email address will not be published. Externally, the engine has an Edelbrock Performer intake fed by an Edelbrock 750-cfm carb. Owner Billy Revis has been around forever and can wrench on just about anythingas you'd expect from a facility located in the midst of hardcore NASCAR country. No advertisment intended, but flowkooler sells a kit of robertshaw thermostat + bypass plate for a fair price. I am running a 351C intake on my 400 and since it is about a 1 taller the distributor won't go all the way in. It featured a half-inch longer stroke than the 302, and even in standard passenger car form (there was no performance version of the 351W) it equaled the Boss 302's factory horsepower rating. The racing D.U.I. It also checked for flutter (tooth-to-tooth error), which, according to Comp engineer Billy Godbold, "Can be a bigger issue than runout as that results from errors in the tooth shape. For example the 351-2V engine has a different horsepower rating for Mercury, Montego and Cougar. The 351C 4V motors, and even the smaller 1969 & 1970 Boss 302, offered head flow unmatched by any (regular) production small block Ford, Chevy, or Dodge heads of the period. That can also mess with the lash settings. Each is tuned separately, yet ultimately together as RPM increases. The Super Coil is much more than the OEM model. Even the firing order was different. (This problem also exists with Duraspark distributors). Distributor differences: The 351W has a smaller 1.245 diameter distributor gear, and the 351C has a larger 1.418 diameter distributor gear. Available beginning in November 1970, the Boss 351 carried very little forward from earlier Boss Mustangs. The common consensus in the aftermarket community is sticking to a 0.040 overbore, although we have heard of bores up to 0.060. If you use a standard thermostat on these engines, the bypass valve will not be blocked, leading to overheating. But while Ford had the big-block and small-block engines covered, a hole had developed. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. Does the oil pump drive hex have to be exactly in alignment with the gear? Does anyone know where I can find one? The Windsor carried Ford through the best and worst of times over a 30-year period, beginning in 1961. } If you want a clean appearance without clutter, the D.U.I. Another key upgrade was the operating angle of the 351C's valves. I just realized you inquired about a Ford TFI distributor, not the Explorer cam sync unit. ", The worst was yet to come. While thermostat failure is a common cause of the overheating, bad radiators and radiator caps, failed water pumps, and coolant leaks are also common overheating causes. Excessive oil consumption coupled with the exhaust smoke is the second best tell-tale sign. New edelbrock carb, new plugs, new wires, malory hei distributor, high volume mechanical fuel pump. Soft bronze gears are usually used with high-end hardened billet-steel mechanical roller cams. You may run a flat tappet cam cam gear or a hyd. Thanks Jon Sponsored Links (REGISTERED USERS DO NOT SEE THIS POST/AD! a buddy just went through this nightmare in a mustang with a C. YES! NASCAR engine builders improved port efficiency by using epoxy to raise the port floor and reduce the opening of both intake and exhaust ports by around 30 percent. And if you choose to tune your Mallory HEI, both mechanical and vacuum advances are programmable and easy to access. Made of 6061-T6 billet aluminum, Crane Pro-Curves can be tuned without removing the distributor cap. Apparently for reasons that are completely beyond me, that might be relatively common that people removed the bypass plate. How the spark plugs light up determines the firing sequence of the cylinders in a gasoline engine. The 351C is referred to as the Cleveland due to its manufacturing location of Brook Park, Ohio, a suburb of Cleveland. Having observed debris flaking off the damaged gears, Revis checked to see if the rod and main bearings were OK. "We dropped the Milodon replacement oil pan, then pulled the main and rod caps. Got any tricks or tips, I'm really lost on this on. A major upgrade for an old Cleveland, these free-flowing, closed-chamber, Australian castings flow enough air to make over 600 flywheel horsepower on an optimized engine, yet their improved intake and exhaust ports remain in the stock 2V location so existing intakes and headers can still bolt on. Toyota RAV4 Years to Avoid [Worst to Best], Small Block Chevy Firing Order [With Diagram], 15 Best Nerdy & Geeky Cars of 2023 [Ideas & Images], Tesla Model 3 Tire Pressure [Correct PSI], Ford Focus Tire Pressure [Correct PSI & KPA], GMC Terrain Years to Avoid [Best & Worst], GMC Acadia Years to Avoid [Best & Worst Period], What is a Spark Plug Firing order? Like a rearend ring-and-pinion, you want the wear pattern in the center. Ford has publicly recommended a maximum overbore of 0.030 due to the thin cylinder walls. Revis had a local machine shop examine the cam's wear pattern. I have shaved some material off the intake but Im not sure how much I can take off. Anyway, lets jump in and discuss the 351 Cleveland issues and then finish up with thoughts on overall reliability. Cranes line of ignition enhancers include the #6000-6040 Fireball Hi-6 multi-spark capacitive discharge that can withstand up to 14.0:1 compression. So unless youre building a stealthy stocker, avoid using factory distributors. He pushed down on the unit while rotating the engine. The 351 M-code is not to be mistaken with the 351M engine. However, Ford decided to make numerous improvements and changes to the engines produced in the Cleveland plant such as freer flowing heads. When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. It seems to be a little stronger; it has more torque. We are the no.1 wholesale marketer of distributors in the country. 351Cs with two-barrel carburetors had larger ports and valves. This new dizzy wont even engage the gear no matter how many times I move the shaft and pinion. You can tell a 351 Cleveland engine at a glance by its rectangular valve covers. For additional information on products offered by CARDONE, visit www.cardone.com. Two versions of the cylinder head were produced. When you buy a prebuilt hot rod, try to get the car's complete info and history. Choose a distributor for what your engine will do most of the time. retained most all of the Boss 351's superb hardware, three key revisions had a big impact on the engine's output. Previously available for more "mainstream" engines, poly-carbon gears have gained a following due to their light weight, no break-in requirement, andmost importantly, in this casecompatibility with any cam billet material. Turns out there was a broken rocker on No. This lead to further oil starvation issues as it worsened oil flow to the mains. What is the difference between the 351 Cleveland and the 351 Windsor engines? Outside of ensuring proper seat contact, the guides also prevent gases from getting into the crankcase and oil from getting into the combustion chamber during intake strokes. I was fortunate that the engine just didn't grenade.". after about 30 minutes it can loose. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. By 1974, performance was over. All times are GMT-6. 351W and Cleveland weight the same, no cracking unless its hot it gets hot because a SCB guy forgets to put the restrictor in for the thermostat and they out flow all factory heads except the Hemi and the Boss 429. I guess the DUI is out of the question. Je souhaite achet un ranchero squire de 1970 , 5.8 L :M Cleveland , les carburateur ont t chang pour plus de puissance. There was a pop and the engine just quit. 5.0 H.O 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8 L410 V8 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8 Check Out 350 TBI Firing Order What is the difference between the 351 Cleveland and the 351 Windsor engines? The above distributor from Rock Auto confused me. 518 red, 50ml tube, Pump, engine oil, standard-pressure/volume, FILTER, engine oil, performance, 22-psi relief-valve (used after break-in), LUBRICANT, camshaft break-in and engine assembly, 4oz container, OIL, engine, Rotella 15W-40, 1qt bottle (used after break-in), GEAR, distributor driven, carbon ultra-poly composite, Ford 335-385 series engines. Alternators had oversized pulleys to prevent overspeed. and get all the new deets right in your inbox, Leaders in automotive prformancee and tuning guides, Please enable JavaScript in your browser to submit the form, Best Ford Raptor Cold Air Intake Upgrades, 2.3L Ford Ranger Intercooler Upgrade Guide, Ford Mustang 2.3 EcoBoost Downpipe Upgrade Guide, Best Ford Mustang 2.3L EcoBoost Bolt-on Performance Mods. Existing engines grew in displacement; the 352 grew to 390 ci, then 406, 427, and 428. The carburetor looked like any other Autolite 4300, but the Boss used a 4300-D with the spread-bore patternsmaller primaries and larger secondaries. : For registered members this ad will NOT show, You can install two shear pins in the gear/shaft or run a regular, Cobra Make, Engine: Coupe,Blue w/white stripes SB; Roadster, Blue w/white stripes BB w/2-4s; SPF installer/Hot Rod-Custom Car builder. Am running an aftermarket High Volume oil pump. Performance Distributors offers two basic types of electronic ignition systems for Clevelands. In fact, I just replaced my radiator, tubes and hoses after I had a cracked cylinder head only to find that the previous owner had removed the bypass plate. The observed cam gear wear started at the center and went all the way back off the teeth. 's, about a tenth or two quicker than a similar 351W Mach 1 from a year earlier. This allowed for slightly larger valve diameter and smoother bends in the port contours. The 351 Cleveland has a higher compression ratio than the 351 Windsor, which contributes to its higher horsepower and torque output. For the street, you want the MSD #8477 Pro-Billet distributor with a vacuum advance. Engine Series: Cummins Diesel Powers Dodge For Cylinder Head Oil Leak Or Weepage Found On Tech Feature: Small Block Chevy and Ford Radiator hose connects to water neck on the front of the intake manifold. If you liked this article you will LOVE the full book. system is your best choice. Your 351 Cleve. There is a specific heat range that the heads are capable of withstanding. Ford's engine development was on the move. In Ford's advance press materials it was called the 351 H.O., though in other Ford lit it is referred to as the Boss 351, which it has come to be known today. Exhaust manifolds, having been designed well in the first place, were standard 351 production. Are you restoring or rebuilding a Ford distributor for a 1965-1973 Mustang? Could you comment on which thermostat temp you would recommend? The thermostat on the 351C is unique. This is a must for those wishing to upgrade the ignition system. The Hi-6 is fully tunable with two rotary switches you can adjust with a small, flat-blade screwdriver. After running into production capacity limitations at the Windsor plant, Ford began producing the 351 engines in the Cleveland plant. Purchased in 1988 for $1800. The muscle car movement had peaked, imports continued to take market share, governmental regulations were on the rise, and the biggest new growth market was in a wave of subcompacts. Ford Overbore Recommendation: 0.030 overbore maximum, Performance Community Recommendation: 0.040 overbore maximum, Maximum Overbore: 0.060 overbore (not recommended). The shaft size is 12.7mm compared to the worn 12.35 of the old dizzy (ancient Mallory DP). After break-in, he final-filled the engine with "the good stuff": Rotella 15W-40 diesel oil that still has lots of anti-scuff ZDP agents (although they're not strictly needed with a roller cam), plus a premium Motorcraft performance oil filter whose bypass valve opens at a higher pressure than the valve in standard-replacement filters. It runs hard!". It was, in essence, a warmed-over 351 four-barrel, but with lower-compression (9.0:1), open-chamber heads, and only a few of the Boss 351's goodies: four-bolt mains, a slightly upgraded hydraulic-lifter cam (0.480/0.488-inch lift and 270/290 degrees duration intake/exhaust), dual-point distributor, and the Autolite spread-bore 4300-D carburetor. It had a taller block to accommodate the longer stroke, but there was never a performance version of the 400. Also in 1968, a new big-block engine family, utilizing similar weight-reducing designs, appeared as the 429. Click the button below and we will send you an exclusive deal on this book. Despite the performance prowess of the 351C heads, their weakness was cracking. All the good stuff is here: four-bolt mains, giant ports and valves, high-compression combustion chambers, forged pistons, aluminum intake, and Ram Air. My mechanic friend, Mike Harvey, put two and two together and saw the distributor wasn't turning. Poor finish on camshaft drive-gear: This can cause premature distributor gear wear. A modern and compact 289 small-block replaced the obsolete 292 Y-block in 1962, and was upsized to a 302 in 1968. The Autolite/Motorcraft distributor family consists of distributors with bronze bushings, with some having only one bushing and others having two. The 351C thermostat has a restrictor plate, or bypass orifice plate located underneath the thermostat. Two versions of the 351C were built for 1970, a two-barrel engine and a four-barrel. This is a high-performance street distributor engineered and manufactured for ease of use with an easy to access and adjust mechanical advance and a vacuum advance you can adjust with a simple Allen wrench. The bearings looked good with no scouring." Here are a few problems you are likely to encounter when using an old distributor. A performance engine builder may use these camshafts to create a motor that runs more smoothly, distributes fuel more evenly, and lasts longer in terms of the crankshaft and main bearings. Boss 351 heads were machined for threaded 7/16-inch rocker pedestals (production 351s used pressed-in 5/16 studs), and the valves were fitted with hardened, single-groove valve keepers. font:bold 14px verdana,arial,helvetica; Includes the major parts required to fix the problem. Unlike 4x4 truck systems of the day, these systems were always engaged and could not be disengaged by the driver. The 351 Cobra Jet was gone, at least in name. Please register or login to enable Dark Mode. It makes a 90 bend from the radiator to the engine block. Not Yet Reviewed. Find FORD 5.8L/351 Ford Cleveland Distributors and get Free Shipping on Orders Over $109 at Summit Racing! While the 351W was obviously an extension of the 289/302, the new 351C was its own thing. This level is considered reliable within the performance community while anything more thin than that is likely to break in high horsepower applications. Both versions were flowed significantly more air than the 351W heads. Some billet steel cams have a regular cast steel gear pressed on them and some don't. Click on the purchases tab above, and you will be shocked as to how many people are buying this unit. To put the new design into production, Ford spent big. My question related to ignition timing curve for the 351 Cleveland. I went with the suggestions of several people over the years on Cleveland motors and put a billet drive in and a steel pin through the gear. If you are concerned about over-boring or block strength, you should have the cylinder sonic tested. Two-barrel engines got 2.04/1.65-inch valves, intake/exhaust, and four-barrel engines got 2.19/1.71-inch valves. If the guides are excessively worn the valves can get off-track and close against the seat at a slight angle, eventually leading to cracked valves. The 351 Clevor is a moniker given by enthusiasts when the block of a 351W is coupled with the heads from a 351C. The rest of the engine was standard 351 four-barrel. We have noticed other units on the market, but few are of this quality. This distributor also has the performance curve setup. Chances are your street Cleveland isnt going to see 8,000. - Ok I just got done with a similar problem with my waterneck. I had tab that cast into the housing by the cap that beat on in both directions. This is caused by differences in the exhaust, air intake and emission control systems. The 351C has an extra two inches on the block, making it a heavier engine. approved. Does not include miscellaneous small parts, labor, tuning, shipping, or sales taxes. E-Curve has been successfully tested on the dyno. I would like to know if I can use a 460 with remote TFI with the Terminator EFI? Like the 429, which got the performance treatment after first appearing as a passenger car engine, the 351 had a hot new version for 1971. Two-barrel 351s had heads with large ports and valves, while four-barrel 351s got very large ports and valves, and a 600-cfm Autolite 4300-A carburetor on an iron, dual-plane intake manifold. The newest advances in precise thin-wall casting processes were used to create a computer-designed, smaller, and broader cylinder block. .hdr1 { This is primarily a racing distributor, though it can be used for street. background-color:#FFFFFF; in most of its press materials. I have a moderate cam and have played with the static timing, finding that this engine seems to like about 20 degrees best. the motor is getting fuel and fire, but won't run. A larger intercooler will decrease intake air temps which results in more power, consistent performance, and a healthier and more reliable engine. Mechanical advance is based on Delco distributors of long ago, which were easy to tune because the advance was right under the rotor. Heavy-duty oil pump driveshaft clearance: Some heavy-duty oil pump driveshafts may not allow an EFI distributor to slide down far enough over the oil pump driveshaft. The thin cylinder walls create potential reliability issues and block cracks with overboring, and the oiling system is inadequate without modifications. Always check that the terminals are clean and tight. 1993 GT 13,000 miles, Built 2-12-93 Auto, 3:27 Axle, cloth, sunroof, AC. All of the old distributors we see have excess end play in the shaft. font:bold 20px verdana,arial,helvetica; By 1974, emissions concerns were increasing and the era of high-performance muscle cars was coming to an end, decreasing interest in the 351C and ultimately leading to its retirement. When you get on the phone with these folks, its like chatting with an old friend. The Shop Squad is assembling to advance the automotive repair industry through education, resources and dialogue. Performance Distributors (in Memphis, Tennessee) enjoys a great reputation for building affordable high-quality ignition systems for Ford applications. Your other choice is the revolutionary #32820 Davis Unified Igniton (D.U.I. At a minimum, they'll bleed-down the hydraulic lifters, causing a noisy valvetrain. An MSD billet distributor gets the once over on a distributor machine. Need A 351 Cleveland TFI Distributor. When the engine is cold the thermostat will be in the closed position, recirculating coolant through the engine and blocking it from entering the radiator to heat the engine more quickly. Copyright 2022 Holley Performance Products, Inc. All right reserved. MSD distributors have a tunable mechanical advance so you can swap springs and bushings to get total timing dialed in. Technical Resources for diagnosing and servicing undercar components, For additional information on products offered by CARDONE, visit, Limited-Slip Differentials And Diagnostics, Seven CV Joint Mistakes You Shouldnt Make, AAPEX Announces Joes Garage Training Schedule, The May Digital Edition Is Ready To Download, Read, Read The April Digital Edition For Free Right Now, Understanding the Key Symptoms of a Worn or Failing Drive Shaft, The Benefits of Using OE-Quality Hub Units For Ford IWE-Equipped Trucks, Reprogramming Transmission Control Modules, Driveshaft, Axle and Drivetrain Noise FAQs. The Boss 351 Mustang was dropped, but the Boss 351 engine was carried over mostly intact, only under the 351 H.O. ), which is based on GMs HEI system with a self-contained ignition coil in cap. Reply Like. Overheating is the most common cause of cracked heads in the 351C engine. More cuts were on the way. From the cylinder centerline, intake valves leaned around 9 degrees toward the intake port and around 4 degrees to the side. If going from points to the electronic ignition, this alone is a huge upgrade. Moving on to other issues, the huge valvesprings installed in the heads may have been purchased as part of a head-assembly package by the original owner, but they were monstrous overkill for a hydraulic flat-tappet cam.
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